Sol Invicto: “I would love to do a big grandiose show that demonstrates the vision of what I’ve got in my head…”

It’s been a long time coming, seven years to be precise, but earlier this month, Sol Invicto, the experimental metal project born from the mind of Richie Londres and comprising the talents of Stephen Carpenter (Deftones), Eric Bobo (Cypress Hill), and Dan Foord (Sikth) are ready to unleash their stadium-sized experimental soundscapes on the world.

Having released a very limited album seven years ago, our latest Cover Story finds Sol Invicto brainchild Richie Londres talking to us about the length of time between releases, his visions for the future of the project, and how his mind pictures something more than just a straight-up metal project.

Seven years between the EP and the rare album. First of all, why was now the right time to put it out?

“I think it’s just one of those things where things line up and they make sense. I’ve been doing it a very independent route for a long time and I’d got very used to that and quite enjoy it, even though it’s a lot harder the route to go down. The independent route is always more difficult but things just lined up. I had planned to get the music done a couple of years before. Realistically, this should have probably come out in 2021 but, because of everything going on, you have to get on with normal life and go, ‘Okay, I’ll put this to the side and come back to it.’

I work as well. I’m always doing various things so this is, it’s not a hobby. It’s my passion, it’s very serious, but it has to take second place sometimes to what I’m doing. That was the main reason. Also, the reason we got the deal with the distributors was because I ended up selling the guy a car. I’ve been selling a few cars, that’s what I do as well, and this guy, a friend of a friend, he said to me, ‘Oh, my friend’s moved over from South Africa. He’s looking for a car. Can you help him out?’ I’ll do that for friends now and again because I know the business, I’ll find them something.

Then he said, ‘I hear you’re into music.” I said, ‘Yeah.’ Usual chat. Send me your stuff. I did but don’t think much of that kind of thing anymore. He ended up loving it and said, ‘We want to do something with you guys.” I thought ‘You know what? I do like the idea of someone else having to deal with all the back-end stuff that I normally have to deal with.’ All I really want to do is focus on the music.

As much as I really enjoy the way I’ve done this as a grassroots thing where I talk to a lot of fans and we engage a lot and it’s a really nice way to do it because you get a very solid fan base like that everything just lined up and then it became a time where I could take quite a few months off work so I thought ‘I’m gonna just get this done.’ and just did it. I would have loved to have done it a few years before but I think it all lined up in the right way as to be honest, it’s been on my mind for years and years every day.”

“I do like the idea of someone else having to deal with all the back-end stuff. All I want to do is focus on the music. ”

In terms of the music then, listening to the three songs on the EP, how has the music changed over that period of time?

“To be fair, they haven’t. I had the bones of them. We hadn’t messed with them too much. We had a structure and everything was pretty much laid out. We just hadn’t done the tweaks to them, the more back-end stuff. I hadn’t done any back lines to them or I hadn’t put my guitars onto them yet. That was what I’ve been doing with myself and Dan, the drummer. We just got in the studio over here and we just started to pick it apart and produce it properly, put everything in the right place.

The sound of the EP is always the sound of the band I have had in my head anyway so it’s always been what I wanted to do, it just took a bit longer. This way, because it’s been more like a project for me, it’s been ups and downs and then you do some stuff. For me, I just like to release music so I think, before that, I just wanted a way to release directly to fans without any delays or having to have a release schedule.

I’ve turned a few deals down in the past purely because of my stubbornness. They were decent deals, but they weren’t exactly what I wanted. I just said, ‘If I’m going to hand over effectively some of the rights to you for this, it’s so important to me that the right people are working with it, and I’m allowed to do what I need to do.’ There was a period of time when I didn’t want to do anything like interviews and stuff, even though I love this kind of thing, it’s why I like talking to people but, at that point, I just didn’t want to be told what to do.

I was like, ‘I just want to do it like this. Just leave me to do it.’ Then I think you grew up, and I started thinking how I wanted to get this out properly, so people can hear it, and I don’t want to be holding it back. It needs to be out there as we’re really proud of it which was the other reason. Get it, let it spread its wings.”

As much as it’s a business and a career, it’s also a passion project for you. How frustrating has it been and how have you overcome the challenges to get to where you are now?

“It’s difficult. I think I’ve always been built for this kind of thing. I do well under stress. I’m very stubborn, stubborn is probably the wrong word, but I know what I want from something so I will do it that way and if something doesn’t align with that, it’s not going to work for me. I don’t really like to compromise and it’s a real test of your emotional state just having to because it’s such a passionate project and it’s something you love doing, it’s very hard to separate yourself from that in business.

I’ve done okay, and I’m happy with everything I’ve done, but it’s been a hard slog as far as you’re swimming upstream all the time. I think when this project started, it was in the early days, streaming wasn’t a big thing and people were still buying CDs so there weren’t the facilities for an artist like there are now.

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I think that’s the other big deciding factor for me, it’s so much easier to get the music out to people in a very concise way. Before, I remember you had to email Apple to try and get an account with iTunes to see if they’ll release your music and I’ve done it before where we packaged up and sold all of our vinyls. I did all that myself… signed every one of them. I love doing that sort of stuff, but it is very taxing and then obviously life happens around that as well. I think it’s one of those things that I’ll never stop making music.

I’ll never give up like making music. I think that the takeaway is you have got to keep pushing forward. It’s nearly broken me a couple of times like there was a period when we nearly got some deals and I think I was exhausted by the bullshit of the industry and all that ‘Oh yeah, let’s do this, and let’s do that, and let’s do lunch, and we’ll sign you up,’ and all that kind of stuff. I just wanted to talk to normal people, and just release music through it to fans.

Now it’s good because, now, I’m doing it in the way that I wanted to do it, and I haven’t had to, albeit let’s say it’s like 10 years later, but I’m very happy with being able to do it how we’re doing it now. Also, I think a lot of people didn’t expect us to release anything, so it’s quite a nice surprise.”

“I don’t really like to compromise and it’s a real test of your emotional state just having to because it’s such a passionate project…”

For somebody that doesn’t like to compromise, even given the 10-year difference, it must be quite a proud moment to put it out and say ‘I’ve done it on my terms.’?

“Absolutely. It’s very rewarding doing it that way because you don’t look back… I wouldn’t say I have any regrets, but there were a couple of times when I made decisions for the project where there was a label that was very interested in and a good label as well and I’d probably still sign with them today but, at that point, I just focused on this way. I didn’t like what I heard. Nothing to do with them. They were great but it just didn’t fit with what I wanted.

So, there’s always part of me that thinks that I should have realistically, given it a go but I think as corny as it is. I think everything happens at the right time and this for me it’s just the right time for it. The reception has shown me that which has been really cool as we haven’t had to push it too much. We’ve just put it out there and it’s just been a nice, organic way to get it to the market.”

Where did Steph Eric and Dan fit into all of this?

“I guess the core members of the band are myself, Eric, Stephen, Dan, and Tech Itch, so these are the fixed members of the band effectively. I started this project with a friend of mine who produced the first EP with me and then we sent some stuff to Eric, some drum and bass stuff. He then came back a few weeks later and it had some guitars on it and it sounded really good. I didn’t know who that was and he said ‘That’s Steph,’ and I went ‘What? From Deftones?’ I said, ‘Let’s go back to him and see if he wants to do this,’ because, immediately, I’m quite business-minded in that regard. Let’s do a project because I don’t really like doing one-off things.

I like to do projects I can get involved in. Eric got in touch with Steph and we just started sending stuff backwards and forwards and grew out of that. Then we did some work with a guy called Zach Hill from Hella, he’s a really good drummer. He was on the first EP and that was cool. We just got a load of stuff from him and chopped it up.

There are two parts of the project now, that was me merging the industrial sound and the heavy metal stuff in one thing. In my mind. I was thinking we’ll just have three or four core members and then we’ll bring in a drummer for each EP or each album and we’ll just work with guests. It was all instrumental as well. I wasn’t really looking to work with vocalists. We just progressed from there. I think Dan came into the fold that was when I think it was just a case of the project levelling up each time.

The first EP is very grimy and lo-fi and I love it, but I mastered that with presets on Logic. Let’s put it out. I’m not going to mess around with it. The vibe was right, so it was cool. The next one was slightly more elevated, it was a bit more produced, Dan’s on that one. Then I got Tech Itch involved around the same time then the production level we were pushing it to be a bit more grandiose. I like working with people as well. As much as it’s a project that I steer, it’s still a band, because they’re in it full-time.

The vocalist we’re working with, he’s our in-house, guest vocalist, but that’s only because I’m not sure if we might end up doing a full album with Sean or if we might work with other people, it just depends on how it goes. That’s the core and then we’re down to working with, well, there’s loads of other people that we will work with – drummers, percussionists, but I think the core of it is like, is those guys.”

Sol Invicto ‘Loosely Aware’ EP Artwork

Are there any artists out there that would be on your personal bucket list to collaborate with?

“Loads! It’s different now we’re moving into the vocal realms. There are a few people in that, but I think what I’d like to do is mostly more like remixing bands. Rammstein is a personal favourite band of mine. I’d love to do some stuff for those guys. At the Gates, Meshuggah. The stuff that doesn’t get the electronic treatment. As far as guitarists, there are a lot of shredders that we want to work with. I’m speaking to someone at the minute who is an excellent player. The guys from Will Haven as well.

My approach is I’ll work with anyone cool, like-minded, no bullshit. Dillinger Escape Plan, Greg… I’d love to work with that dude. Just a host of people but that’s why I love doing this project, because now there are no restrictions as far as what we can do with the project being split now. Initially, it was going to be one thing to mash together, but now you’ve heard the EP, that’s going to be the band with a vocalist, very heavy, more metal sort of driven, then the other side of it is going to be the, I guess more experimental side.

It’s still going to be heavy, but we’re going to be able to do hip-hop. We’re going to be able to work with different artists, and different producers that me and Tech Itch will run because Tech Itch is an excellent producer well versed in the technical side of it. I’m more of an ideas man so it’s nice to work with people where I can’t pull my weight they can and it all fits together.”

“My approach is I’ll work with anyone cool, like-minded, no bullshit. Dillinger Escape Plan, Greg… I’d love to work with that dude.”

Working with somebody like that, what do you learn from that?

“I learned, for example, working with someone like Dan, he’s very good at programming and editing whereas I love chopping samples and I’ve made loads of hip-hop and I get really into it, but I’m very in the moment. I don’t view it as a whole progression or I won’t think about the notes or where things should and shouldn’t go. Working with people like that, while I don’t want to change what I do, I want to bring in a little bit of routine or sort of a system to what I do because then I’ll understand it more and I can execute my ideas better, which is what it’s about.

To be honest, for me, it’s more of a case of if I’ve got someone like that, it’s easier for me to execute the idea, something I can’t do, but they can so I let them do their thing. I might ask Dan if we can try switching something around and he’ll either do it or tell me it makes no sense. I’m like, ‘Trust me. Give it a go and then it might work or it might not.’

I think I’ve resigned myself to the fact that I’m not that kind of musician. I can’t read music. I’ve tried to, and I just can’t, it doesn’t suit me. I have to go on the sound, even with plugins, I just move everything around. I know a little bit, I’m not completely oblivious to it, but it just doesn’t sit with me. I just have to mess around with the music until my ear tunes into it and then it makes sense.”

Have you got a vision for when your ear tunes into the sound where you say that fits…

“A hundred per cent. With the EP side of Sol Invicto, the main project, shall we say… I want it to be a grand, really heavy, intense kind of cinematic experience. So, what we’ve got on the EP, the case on the album, I’ll expand upon that. There will be a lot more dynamics to it and I want it to have a lot of feeling. I’ve always wanted to hear a version of Meshuggah that was less Meshuggah where you’ve got the solid groove of someone like Rammstein locked in there and then you do a bit of flair in between. Not too much, but it shows people there’s a bit of range to it.

I just like a big cinematic, apocalyptic end-of-the-world kind of sound. I guess that is what I’m going for but with a lot of feelings. When I’m making the songs, when I play the right notes, I can visualize something there and it’s always massive landscapes. I guess that’s the vibe that comes through. I’ve got almost massive stadium-level sounds. Now, whether we’ll play one or not is, that’s another story. I’ll be happy with a smaller gig but that’s the vision. It’s very visual, a very emotive sound.”

“With the EP side of Sol Invicto, the main project, shall we say… I want it to be a grand, real heavy, intense kind of cinematic experience…”

The first band that came to mind when I listened to the EP was Meshuggah but talking about the cinematic, dramatic soundscapes side of it do you see that appealing to somebody that likes Nine Inch Nails and Trent Reznor’s work?

“Absolutely. There will be more space on an album to creep all that stuff in. I think for this stuff, I just wanted to have a big impact. I’ve cut these songs down quite a lot because, you know, There were a few sections where the songs were seven or eight minutes long because I put in loads of synth interludes but I think now’s not the right time for that.

I didn’t want to come in and reveal too much of the sound yet. I need an album for that because I like it to have a bit of an old-school mentality, as I do think there are still people who do still sit down and listen to albums all the way through which is nice, rather than that whole let’s put a record out every month to keep the engagement going which is a bit anti-artist really.”

Do you think it would have been easier putting the album out maybe five or six years ago when the industry was very different and streaming wasn’t so much of a thing back then?

“I think it’s weird because, as an independent, there’s a lot more reach now for us to get to. I think if we were signed up with a label it’s always better earlier on because your album sales would be better. More of an old school approach, the press is more old school press, everything’s a bit more traditional but I think the reach now, well as much as I’m not a massive fan of streaming, because, to me, it’s just a calling card.

It doesn’t bring you any revenue. It’s not benefiting the artist aside from just showing people that you’re there. If you’re getting some traction, it’s great but, if you’re not, it’s a false economy because they say reach billions of people but won’t because you’ll get buried by everyone else. Now, if it’s working for you, it’s really good. We’ve got a few fans pop up in places like India, China, and Africa, and they would’ve never have got the music, had it not been for streaming. I love that fact.

“If you’re getting some traction, it’s great but, if you’re not, it’s a false economy because they say reach billions of people but won’t because you’ll get buried by everyone else…”

It’s a double-edged sword, isn’t it? There is a lot of talk in the industry now. It’s completely out of whack in favour of the streaming companies and the labels that are investing in them. The artists are getting the short end of the stick, which is wrong. There should be a lot more money. Spotify should be reinvesting in the industry, but it’s not, it’s just taking and not putting the money back in.

Just telling people to keep creating, and understand the business model, but it’s very unfair on artists to try to get to a certain threshold so they can say they can quit their job and focus on this because they’ve got done a million streams. If you got a million plays 10 years ago, that’d be incredible. They’d be all over you. We’re only on, I think total streams, we’ve got about 200, 000, which is a lot of streams but it’s nothing at the same time. It’s crazy.”

Back 10 years ago, if you’d have sold 200,000 that would be massive numbers…

“Absolutely. It’s weird that it’s changed. It’s changed the parameters. It has changed the points where people are impressed now. It shouldn’t matter… the numbers are irrelevant. All that should matter is the quality of the music or if you like it. It’s definitely a double-edged sword but I’m not going to knock it because, at the end of the day, there are a lot of people that wouldn’t hear the music if we were not on these.

I think that the people who do support your band will still come through and buy stuff. We still sell all the merch directly. We’re going to do CDs and vinyl as long as it’s paying for itself. We’re getting to new fans and it’s just part of it now. You can’t fight it.”

Onto the album then. You’ve talked about it being a two-part project. What’s the situation with the album?

“We’re looking at pencilling in April to release a full album. In between now and then we’re going to do a remix EP of the EP we just put out. I’m doing that with Tech Itch at the minute. That will come out but I don’t know if we’re going to stream that. We’ll probably just Bandcamp it and keep it a bit more private like the original project. We’ll do a few collaborations.

I’ve got all the old stuff that we’ve never released publicly. We’re probably going to put that out in late January for people. I’ll probably tweak it a little bit, but it’ll be pretty much what it was before just with some slight changes and extra things. We’ll put that out to just bridge the gap. It’s nice that there is YouTube and places, but I’d rather people be able to get it directly from us and it’s high quality.

It will give more context to the band as well because it’s been through quite a lot of changes behind the scenes that people don’t maybe know about and that would explain the sound and where we’re going.”

“The artists are getting the short end of the stick, which is wrong. There should be a lot more money. Spotify should be reinvesting in the industry, but it’s not, it’s just taking and not putting the money back in.”

You’ve talked about this grandiose stadium-sized music, what about taking it out on the road and touring?

“I’d love to. That’s the good thing about it. We don’t need everyone to do shows. We could go and effectively do a smaller show. I could just go out with Dan and Eric can do some sort of electronic, hybrid show where we’re triggering stuff or we could do more of a full band situation. I was talking about it a lot with Eric actually, and he was very keen and so am I on doing a full band – a very visual presentation of it. Like Gorillaz, that kind of thing.

I don’t think we’ll do a tour because I’d rather be in the studio personally and I know all the other guys because they’re older and stuff. They’ve done all that and we’d have a great time but I think with everyone’s schedules, it’d be difficult for us to go off on tour for four months so what we’ll probably do is we’ll just do smaller, more exclusive shows in major cities. I guess that would be my way of doing it. If there’s a call for it, if people want to take it on the road, then we’ll do whatever.”

Do you see two different types of shows – the metal full-on and then the more electronic, cinematic show? Do you think that would work?

“Absolutely. That’s why I wanted to do it like that because the other way, it just allows me and, for example, Tech Itch, to go out and we can do DJ sets or we could do hybrid sets with the drummer. I think both projects will allude to the other one. It’s not like it won’t be live, it just won’t need a guitarist. It will be something where we can take some samples, and mess it up. I would love to do a big grandiose show that demonstrates the vision of what I’ve got in my head.”

That leads me to my last question to wrap up. What is your future vision, long-term say a few years down the road?

“The long and short of it is I want to move, and we’ve started to move, into the more film school and TV world as well. This is a project that would… it’s a very visual project, so I would love to be scoring films like anything sci-fi or that kind of Blade Runner type of film, with myself as a composer, and producer, that’s where I see my music going with this project. I think within that sphere. That will allow me to do shows with this as well… like a Hans Zimmer kind of thing.

Eventually, I think that’s the vibe we’ll go… like TV film, not just producing stuff like library music, but actually making original scores and going for it that way. I’d love to push more into that. We did have kind of a deal on the table before the pandemic. There’s a time and a place for it. It will come back. I’ll let the music do the talking and we’ll just build it up again.”